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  • Grey
    replied
    Originally posted by PCapitalist View Post
    Arsenal is our competition for the CL? We have hammered them on aggregate 50-0 over the past 4 years. Barcelona? We just hammered them 8-2 or am I missing something. Chelsea??? We hammered those 10-0. United????? They haven't been on the CL over the past 8 years!!!

    If Bayern were in a final tomorrow, the most difficult opponents would be Liverpool and possibly PSG. Maybe add Madrid for the sheer weight of their pedigree.

    We sold Thiago to one of the 2 or 3 teams that would have the best chances to beat us in a tie.

    Sent from my Mi A3 using Tapatalk


    Arsenal had the privilege of meeting Bayern in the CL numerous times over the past 10 years. Liverpool can't even hold that accolodade.

    But yeah, I'm sure we're about to hear a really convincing argument why Scunthorpe are our direct rivals because Arsenal have a worse goal deficit against Bayern lmao. This screams of international fans after the 2004 Euros who were absolutely CONVINCED Greece was gonna be the next big player on the international scene, all because of one good year. Relax, if Liverpool were really 30% as good as you all say, they'll have no problem creating a track record against Bayern.

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  • PCapitalist
    replied
    Originally posted by Grey View Post
    Dortmund, Chelsea, City, Real, Atletico, Barcelona, PSG, Sevilla, Arsenal, and Manchester United are all teams with bigger stating power than Liverpool and you bet your ass I just said that about Arsenal.

    The recency bias is insane. Look, I’m open to the idea that Liverpool is the best team of all time, ready to win the next 3 CLs in a row, I really am. They’re a fun team with an enormous upward trajectory. But it’s been all of two whole seasons of success, that’s it. There’s literally nothing any team can do in the space of such short time to immediately change the status quo. They’re going to need a couple more seasons of staying power before we’re going to be able to tell.

    Here’s an anology all Bayern fans should get. Neuer was the best keeper in the world in 2010, but it wasn’t until 2013/14 that he started being considered as such among all international fans. That doesn’t mean the international fans were wrong, only that it took 3-4 years to be able to tell for sure. With Liverpool you all may be 100% correct; we just won’t be able to know, objectively, until a few seasons go by. Until then, their entire success til now can be attributed to nothing more than luck and good form.
    Arsenal is our competition for the CL? We have hammered them on aggregate 50-0 over the past 4 years. Barcelona? We just hammered them 8-2 or am I missing something. Chelsea??? We hammered those 10-0. United????? They haven't been on the CL over the past 8 years!!!

    If Bayern were in a final tomorrow, the most difficult opponents would be Liverpool and possibly PSG. Maybe add Madrid for the sheer weight of their pedigree.

    We sold Thiago to one of the 2 or 3 teams that would have the best chances to beat us in a tie.

    Sent from my Mi A3 using Tapatalk



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  • EM1R
    replied
    That wouldn't happen had he stayed here.

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  • L4nd3r
    replied
    It seems he tested positive for COVID-19.

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  • Grey
    replied
    Dortmund, Chelsea, City, Real, Atletico, Barcelona, PSG, Sevilla, Arsenal, and Manchester United are all teams with bigger stating power than Liverpool and you bet your ass I just said that about Arsenal.

    The recency bias is insane. Look, I’m open to the idea that Liverpool is the best team of all time, ready to win the next 3 CLs in a row, I really am. They’re a fun team with an enormous upward trajectory. But it’s been all of two whole seasons of success, that’s it. There’s literally nothing any team can do in the space of such short time to immediately change the status quo. They’re going to need a couple more seasons of staying power before we’re going to be able to tell.

    Here’s an anology all Bayern fans should get. Neuer was the best keeper in the world in 2010, but it wasn’t until 2013/14 that he started being considered as such among all international fans. That doesn’t mean the international fans were wrong, only that it took 3-4 years to be able to tell for sure. With Liverpool you all may be 100% correct; we just won’t be able to know, objectively, until a few seasons go by. Until then, their entire success til now can be attributed to nothing more than luck and good form.

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  • OnlyInsider
    replied
    Our true European rival is and will always be Real Madrid. There's not a more played fixture in European football than FC Bayern München - Real Madrid, it's matches every one loves to see.

    In short it's the European classic and it doesn't get bigger than this in international football.

    https://www.foxsports.com/soccer/gal...history-041217

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  • Thirteen
    replied
    Nobody really said they're our rivals, this whole debate started when Grey said they're not even our competition, which is a gross overreaction.

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  • Muller25
    replied
    How can a team that we have literally played twice in the last 19 years be our rival?
    Furthermore a club that we've played 3 times in nearly 40 years.

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  • mea95
    replied
    Originally posted by Grey View Post
    Look, Thiago left Bayern because he wanted a challenge. By his own definition Liverpool are an inferior team.
    Your rival isn't necessarily bigger/better than you. As I've said they have weak points and we can beat them, but they are a solid team and can also beat us.


    Originally posted by Grey View Post
    There are literally 10 teams that are bigger rivals than Liverpool.
    I don't know what's your definition of "rival". Could you please list those 10 teams?

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  • OnlyInsider
    replied
    It's funny to think that Liverpool only won the CL in recent times because of major fuck ups from their opponents. Not only were they fecking lucky to get out of the groupstage in 2005, it took them 2 goals in the last 10 mins against Olympiakos to go through.

    Then Milan absolutely hammered them in the first half and should've won comfortably. Liverpool only got back because Milan got complacent not to forget Gerrard dived to get a penalty. Even as the game was 3-3 was it powerplay toward Liverpools goal.

    In 2019 they again had to rely on one of the biggest choke jobs ever and Barca gave it to them. They never had a CL campaign like us where they were so much better than anybody else, not to forget they don't have any trebles lol.

    With that said, I respect their pedigree in Europe but even if we both have 6 European Cups are ours definitely more impressive imo. When we won in 2013 and this year we were just so much better than anybody else.

    Another thing is Liverpool fans really became smug lately. It took them just 2 good seasons to forget where they're coming from in the past 25-30 years.

    Leave a comment:


  • Grey
    replied
    Liverpool hasn’t even shown an ability to consistently quality for Europe yet they’re our direct rival?

    There are literally 10 teams that are bigger rivals than Liverpool. It’s astounding to me how much deference you all are willing to show to them for precisely 0 reason at all. We’re supposed to be impressed by ONE league title? By one of the ugliest CL runs in the weakest iteration in years? Come the fuck on. It’s time to stop pretending that two accidental accolades are enough to bring Liverpool anywhere near our level.

    Look, Thiago left Bayern because he wanted a challenge. By his own definition Liverpool are an inferior team.

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  • mea95
    replied
    Come on, Liverpool are easily one of our direct rivals in the CL.
    Do they have weak points? Definitely. Can we beat them? Sure. But they are still one of the best teams in Europe atm.

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  • Thirteen
    replied
    Originally posted by FernandoBR View Post
    They were trashed by a shitty Atletico... Was exposed by a weak Leeds side and now even Arsenal put them on the ropes...

    They are overrated as fuck.

    For instance: VVD is the EPL player that's most responsible for goals conceded in the last 2 seasons. And yet, he's hailed as the best CB in the world.

    Enviado de meu Moto Z2 Play usando o Tapatalk
    Oh come on, everyone knows how hard it is to play against Atletico. They dominated them but lost, just like we did in 2016. And Arsenal put them on the ropes by scoring from one Robertson blunder, and having two good chances? While Liverpool had 20 shots on goal, you can say Barca put us on the ropes as well then even though they lost 8-2.

    Originally posted by Grey View Post

    It makes no sense to rate a team by its most recent game played. Unfortunately, recency bias is all the rage and people forgot the reality that teams that reach the top don't often stay there long unless they have longevity. To date, the only three teams that show both recent success and longevity are Bayern, Barca, and Real Madrid. If Liverpool conduct themselves well at Europe's highest levels for the next season or two, then maybe we can talk about them having shifted the paradigm. But let's not put the cart in front of the horse. In recent memory, they have a single CL title in one of the worst CLs of all time and one single league title. That's it. It's enormously premature to pretend like they are anything more than a particularly bright flash in the pan at this point.
    Sure longevity is key when watching how good a team was in a period of time, and we are going to be able to do that after Klopp's era ends probably, but to think now Liverpool is not our competition while coming from a PL season where they schooled everyone and even improved their squad after is not it imo. I mean I'm not saying they 'shifted the paradigm' and have removed Barca,Real,Bayern from the top 3 but it's weird to think they aren't our competition and think like they're United or something who are still not back to their best. Liverpool have improved a lot from their banter years in the early and mid 2010s.

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  • Grey
    replied
    Originally posted by Thirteen View Post
    It makes no sense to rate a team currently based on their past. And currently Liverpool is one of the better teams in the world, got even better with Thiago with them. To underrate them would be crazy.
    It makes no sense to rate a team by its most recent game played. Unfortunately, recency bias is all the rage and people forgot the reality that teams that reach the top don't often stay there long unless they have longevity. To date, the only three teams that show both recent success and longevity are Bayern, Barca, and Real Madrid. If Liverpool conduct themselves well at Europe's highest levels for the next season or two, then maybe we can talk about them having shifted the paradigm. But let's not put the cart in front of the horse. In recent memory, they have a single CL title in one of the worst CLs of all time and one single league title. That's it. It's enormously premature to pretend like they are anything more than a particularly bright flash in the pan at this point.

    Leave a comment:


  • FernandoBR
    replied
    Originally posted by Thirteen View Post
    It makes no sense to rate a team currently based on their past. And currently Liverpool is one of the better teams in the world, got even better with Thiago with them. To underrate them would be crazy.
    They were trashed by a shitty Atletico... Was exposed by a weak Leeds side and now even Arsenal put them on the ropes...

    They are overrated as fuck.

    For instance: VVD is the EPL player that's most responsible for goals conceded in the last 2 seasons. And yet, he's hailed as the best CB in the world.

    Enviado de meu Moto Z2 Play usando o Tapatalk

    Leave a comment:

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