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  • #46
    Barca went from MSN to



    [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji23]

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    • #47
      Originally posted by DonAK View Post
      Who need talented players like Neymar, Dembele and Mbappe or even Kevin De Bruyne when you can start a 34 year old Ribery I guess.
      Better that than wasting €100+ million on a potential future star player. Dembélé does have the potential to become a future Ballon d'Or winner, but still, it's utterly ridiculous. So yeah, it's better for Bayern to have (not start) a 34-year-old Ribéry than becoming the laughing stock of the transfer market. But I guess Barca fans see it differently, at least based on what I've read thus far that's how it is.

      I'm glad Bayern dodged the Neymar bullet, I mean look at Barcelona now, the club's a shambles. It's a shame De Bruyne never happened though, a big shame really.

      Oh yeah, and Paulinho. But guess he's better than Tolisso, for example.
      Last edited by micky; 25-08-2017, 18:10.

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      • #48
        Originally posted by micky View Post
        Better that than wasting €100+ million on a potential future star player. Dembélé does have the potential to become a future Ballon d'Or winner, but still, it's utterly ridiculous. So yeah, it's better for Bayern to have (not start) a 34-year-old Ribéry than becoming the laughing stock of the transfer market. But I guess Barca fans see it differently, at least based on what I've read thus far that's how it is.
        I agree it's ridiculous, but Neymar cornered us when he left in August instead of fucking off in June.

        Our pathetic board doesn't make it any better either.

        The board and the club is in a desperate situation with key players and the manager demanding proper reinforcements and Dembele was the best option to replace Neymar as neither Hazard or Dybala(plays a diff position) would come at any cost.

        In the end, he can turn out to be a massive flop or do what Neymar was supposed to do. Lead the attack after Messi.

        Personally I think he's in the best position a young attacker can be in right now. Play alongside and learn from Messi and Suarez.

        If he becomes a BalonDor contender or even wins it in the future then it'll be money well spent.
        Last edited by DonAK; 25-08-2017, 18:13.

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        • #49
          Originally posted by DonAK View Post
          I agree it's ridiculous, but Neymar cornered us when he left in August instead of fucking off in June.
          That's exactly what I meant with the Neymar bullet. I knew that dude isn't good news after his shady transfer to Barca unraveled.

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          • #50
            It's really not that ridiculous. Probably because the concept of money that highlevel stakeholders pull in is lost on fans when highly publicised transfer fees are all that's talked about.

            Of course, they overpaid for Ousmane but the allure of the on pitch success + tickets, merchandise, and following stars bring will exceed the immediate costs unless he gets injured. The problem is the patience required isn't normally found at such large clubs.

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            • #51
              Originally posted by Tommy5Rings View Post
              It's really not that ridiculous. Probably because the concept of money that highlevel stakeholders pull in is lost on fans when highly publicised transfer fees are all that's talked about.

              Of course, they overpaid for Ousmane but the allure of the on pitch success + tickets, merchandise and following stars bring will exceed the immediate costs unless he gets injured.
              This is almost entirely a myth that just won't die.

              Re: Pogba and shirt sales, but the principle is the same:

              Can Paul Pogba’s shirt sales pay for his transfer? No. Here’s why

              Re: the same with Neymar:

              http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/f...-a7874731.html

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              • #52
                who said I think/said that shirt sales alone will recuperate the fee? I listed the first and foremost important thing then added 3 secondary revenue streams. If Ousmane and Mbappe become next generations stars, that will do far more for the Barca, PSG/Real brands than the idea of spending a third of the fee and getting a player who becomes a third as popular and successful on the pitch. As much as we love Müller, he isn't going to bring a generation of stars to Munich the way Neymar could for PSG.

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                • #53
                  Originally posted by Tommy5Rings View Post
                  who said I think/said that shirt sales alone will recuperate the fee? I listed the first and foremost important thing then added 3 secondary revenue streams. If Ousmane and Mbappe become next generations stars, that will do far more for the Barca, PSG/Real brands than the idea of spending a third of the fee and getting a player who becomes a third as popular and successful on the pitch. As much as we love Müller, he isn't going to bring a generation of stars to Munich the way Neymar could for PSG.
                  Who said I said you said this? See, I can play dumb too.

                  All I said is that merchandising is pretty much a non-starter, and I'm right. As far as your other points, I don't really need to address them. If you think that they're magically going to recoup this fee in the blink of an eye, I have a bridge to sell you in Brooklyn.

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                  • #54
                    Originally posted by Grey View Post
                    Who said I said you said this? See, I can play dumb too.

                    All I said is that merchandising is pretty much a non-starter, and I'm right.
                    That would depend on the players brand/potential brand. Think about English talent alone, those teams know that merchandising isn't just whatever shirt sales come in after a deal is made but the possibility of having a legend tied to the club and what that does.

                    Players with huge national followings like Pogba, Neymar, represent markets to clubs outside of simple shirt sales, which I do feel over the course of a contract could represent a significant percentage of a transfer fee.

                    Furthermore, its not just the idea that the clubs only revenue comes from directly from shirt sales. If you buy a kit at the Allianz or through the shop, Bayern records it and same goes for Adidas. The know how much the player brings in in shirt sales and as such clubs get huge money from signing them. That's why these shirt sponsors get involved in these mega deals.

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                    • #55
                      Originally posted by Tommy5Rings View Post
                      That would depend on the players brand/potential brand. Think about English talent alone, those teams know that merchandising isn't just whatever shirt sales come in after a deal is made but the possibility of having a legend tied to the club and what that does.

                      Players with huge national followings like Pogba, Neymar, represent markets to clubs outside of simple shirt sales, which I do feel over the course of a contract could represent a significant percentage of a transfer fee.

                      Furthermore, its not just the idea that the clubs only revenue comes from directly from shirt sales. If you buy a kit at the Allianz or through the shop, Bayern records it and same goes for Adidas. The know how much the player brings in in shirt sales and as such clubs get huge money from signing them. That's why these shirt sponsors get involved in these mega deals.
                      Do you have something to source this other than "feels?" I'm serious when I say this is a fan myth that just won't die. Check the two articles I posted, merchandising accounts for very, very little.

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                      • #56
                        Originally posted by Grey View Post
                        Do you have something to source this other than "feels?" I'm serious when I say this is a fan myth that just won't die. Check the two articles I posted, merchandising accounts for very, very little.

                        this article both address the myth and puts transfer fees into context with shirt deals and overall club finances using united and the prem.

                        On one level, the debate is whether or not Manchester United could have spent the money more wisely and signed better players or players as good as Pogba, for less money.

                        That line of argument ignores the financial and marketing reality of operating a mega-club like Manchester United. The values of Busby and Ferguson have been wiped from the culture of Manchester United in just three years.

                        Spending the same amount of money and signing two or three players may, on paper, improve the performance of the team but a world-record signing – which is what Pogba will be – generates more talk, awareness and it reaffirms the club’s brand as one of the biggest in the world.

                        Then there is not the inconsequential role played by Adidas in the move. Paul Pogba was signed as the new poster boy for Adidas in March this season. By delivering Pogba to Old Trafford Manchester United will certainly make Adidas happy and you cannot underestimate how important it is to maintain a great relationship with a partner that pays you nearly $100M every year.

                        Manchester United are currently Adidas's biggest partner in football with the deal known to be a massive £750m, Biggest ever. #MUFC

                        — TSJ. (@TalkSportJosh) July 27, 2016

                        Finally, there is the size of the investment. In absolute terms $130M seems like a staggering amount of money to pay for a player – especially one who is not yet regarded as one of the best in the world.

                        But as with so many things context is everything. Manchester United will book around $665M in revenue for the 2015/16 financial year. A $130M fee for Pogba constitutes 19.5% of turnover.

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                        • #57
                          This doesn't really address anything except to say that there are long term effects that might come into play regarding marketing. Sure, I can agree with that. But that's not merchandising, that's the down-the-road implications of decades-long sponsorship deals, which can be the length of many player contracts back-to-back. Pogba may be part of this longterm plan, but to say that it is merchandising (rather than sporting success, which you did note in your original post) is pretty silly.

                          Simply put, merchandise sales are very low drivers of financial health. Pogba's transfer (just like Dembele's and Neymar's) was obviously about more than just merchandising, which really just support my point that fans who say that shirt sales (and etc, shirts aren't the only merchandise) will make up astronomical transfer fees simply don't know what they are talking about. It's just a myth perpetuated by fans who like to buy shirts.

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                          • #58
                            Originally posted by Grey View Post
                            This doesn't really address anything except to say that there are long term effects that might come into play regarding marketing. Sure, I can agree with that. But that's not merchandising, that's the down-the-road implications of decades-long sponsorship deals, which can be the length of many player contracts back-to-back. Pogba may be part of this longterm plan, but to say that it is merchandising (rather than sporting success, which you did note in your original post) is pretty silly.

                            Simply put, merchandise sales are very low drivers of financial health. Pogba's transfer (just like Dembele's and Neymar's) was obviously about more than just merchandising, which really just support my point that fans who say that shirt sales (and etc, shirts aren't the only merchandise) will make up astronomical transfer fees simply don't know what they are talking about. It's just a myth perpetuated by fans who like to buy shirts.
                            I don't think the very obvious point of sporting success is the primary driver is agreed upon by everyone. I think the contentious point is the impact these mega signings have on sporting success which has a significant monetary value that isn't alluded to. These clubs bring in astronomical turnover every single year and a mega transfer representing 20% of turnover isn't done without the realization that this is a monetary investment first and foremost and merchandising is a significant piece of that pie, not an afterthought. While shirt sales alone don't recoup fees, they are gigantic driver in the overall revenue stream of clubs and those players sell shirts just as much as crests do.

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                            • #59
                              Originally posted by Tommy5Rings View Post
                              I don't think the very obvious point of sporting success is the primary driver is agreed upon by everyone. I think the contentious point is the impact these mega signings have on sporting success which has a significant monetary value that isn't alluded to. These clubs bring in astronomical turnover every single year and a mega transfer representing 20% of turnover isn't done without the realization that this is a monetary investment first and foremost and merchandising is a significant piece of that pie, not an afterthought. While shirt sales alone don't recoup fees, they are gigantic driver in the overall revenue stream of clubs and those players sell shirts just as much as crests do.
                              See, this is what is patently incorrect.

                              https://www.sportskeeda.com/football...t-sales-club/2

                              Shirt sales are a relatively insignificant source of revenue for the club when you account for player salary. It's the other factors you listed that drive the financial success, but merchandising is really not one of them.

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                              • #60
                                Originally posted by Grey View Post
                                See, this is what is patently incorrect.

                                https://www.sportskeeda.com/football...t-sales-club/2

                                Shirt sales are a relatively insignificant source of revenue for the club when you account for player salary. It's the other factors you listed that drive the financial success, but merchandising is really not one of them.
                                shirt sales are a gigantic driver in shirt deals* which are a gigantic revenue stream for clubs

                                Clarified

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