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Old 15-09-2018, 00:48   #3616
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James is a better CAM than Müller IMO, he can do plenty of things like scoring beautiful free kicks or shooting long shots, his passing is more accurate and let's not talk about his ball control.

That being said the ideal scenario is the one were we can get the most out of both without neglecting one of them, but it's not going to be that simple for Kovac.

I just hope we don't handle James back to Madrid.
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Old 15-09-2018, 00:57   #3617
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James is a better CAM than Müller IMO, he can do plenty of things like scoring beautiful free kicks or shooting long shots, his passing is more accurate and let's not talk about his ball control.

That being said the ideal scenario is the one were we can get the most out of both without neglecting one of them, but it's not going to be that simple for Kovac.

I just hope we don't handle James back to Madrid.
But Muller isn't a CAM though. Scoring beautiful free kicks and long shots are all very well but Has he ever had a season with 35+ scorer points? This is what I mean.
Muller did that 3 seasons in a row. No other CAM or SS bar Messi And Griezmann came close in past 5 years.
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Old 15-09-2018, 00:59   #3618
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James is a top class footballer though, there is no denying that.
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Old 15-09-2018, 01:34   #3619
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Unfortunately, Muller can only rest on his laurels for so long before he needs to produce something new. I don't believe Muller has really performed the way his reputation would suggest since 2013. It was easy enough to defend him in 2015, when he scored the winning goal against Barca in a Pyrrhic victory that saw us knocked out, but it's now been three years since and Muller has done anything noteworthy in an important match. That's not going to cut it much longer, Muller MUST perform.

Even fanboys like me have grown tired of his non-performances.
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Old 15-09-2018, 01:49   #3620
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Champions' league round of 16 and round of 8 aren't big\ important games? If so what a rubbish player Messi, de Bruyne, Hazard etc are.
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Old 15-09-2018, 01:54   #3621
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Champions' league round of 16 and round of 8 aren't big\ important games? If so what a rubbish player Messi, de Bruyne, Hazard etc are.
Nope, not really, they aren't. Especially not for someone with Muller's reputation.

To be clear, Muller's reputation is that he's a title-winner. It was he who scored against Barca in 2013, our hardest and most important match-up that whole CL. It was he who scored what should have been the CL-winning goal in 2012 against Chelsea. And it was he who scored the opening goal against Argentina in 2010, a match that Germany was predicted to lose.

To say that what Muller has done since 2013 is sufficient to justify his reputation is, frankly, to cheapen his reputation. I think you and I - rightfully - rate him a whole hell of a lot better than merely tapping in a needless goal in a RO16 CL match.
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Old 15-09-2018, 02:03   #3622
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This is not even fanboyism, the numbers speak for themselves. Muller, just like Messi has become a victim of his high standards. Granted he doesn't possess the best touch nor is he a dribbling wizard or speedster but man is he a terrific footballer. Of his important goals since 2016, 3 immediately come to mind. His last minute equalizer v Juventus, his opening goal v Besiktas (yes Besiktas) at the stroke of half time last season. A goal without which we would be deep in the proverbial shit with 45 mins left against a deep sitting defense, and his goal v Benfica in Lisbon in the round of 8 to demoralise a rampant Benfica side. Again, he hasn't been at his utmost best in the last 2,seasons and probably last season too but his importance in decisive moments cannot be over-emphasized.

If we can have 2 wingers and Lewy fit at every point in time this season, then I have little doubt we will see the old Muller we all know.
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Old 15-09-2018, 02:07   #3623
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That 2012 header against Cech...that's Muller in a nutshell. I miss him.
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Old 15-09-2018, 02:08   #3624
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This is not even fanboyism, the numbers speak for themselves. Muller, just like Messi has become a victim of his high standards. Granted he doesn't possess the best touch nor is he a dribbling wizard or speedster but man is he a terrific footballer. Of his important goals since 2016, 3 immediately come to mind. His last minute equalizer v Juventus, his opening goal v Besiktas (yes Besiktas) at the stroke of half time last season. A goal without which we would be deep in the proverbial shit with 45 mins left against a deep sitting defense, and his goal v Benfica in Lisbon in the round of 8 to demoralise a rampant Benfica side. Again, he hasn't been at his utmost best in the last 2,seasons and probably last season too but his importance in decisive moments cannot be over-emphasized.

If we can have 2 wingers and Lewy fit at every point in time this season, then I have little doubt we will see the old Muller we all know.
I 100% agree with the last point.

As far as the rest, this just screams of revisionism. We didn't fall in love with Muller for equalizers against b-rate (or worse) teams. We fell in love with him because of how critical he was at the highest levels for every team he ever played for. He's never possessed the greatest of touches, even at his peak, so that's mostly irrelevant to me. Muller hasn't scored a goal worthy of his own well-deserved reputation since 2013 and that's the sad and unfortunate truth. I very much want to see him back to his old heights because he's a far cry from them at this time.
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Old 15-09-2018, 02:17   #3625
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Juve is a b- rate team? Ok Grey do you mind listing the players you think have always been decisive in big UCL games apart from Real Madrid players?
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Old 15-09-2018, 05:11   #3626
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Juve is a b- rate team? Ok Grey do you mind listing the players you think have always been decisive in big UCL games apart from Real Madrid players?
Juve's a B team. Certainly not an A team like Bayern, Barca, or Madrid. I don't think you'll find much disagreement around here.

But that's neither here nor there - you didn't respond to the point, which is that you and I both know that Muller has shown much greater quality in him than what he's exhibited over the last 5 years or so. He has the track record to prove it, too. I think you are grossly underestimating Muller and what he's previously done if you're satisfied by what he's shown recently.
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Old 15-09-2018, 10:12   #3627
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Most important goals of Müller in my opinion:
5. first vs. England (2010)
4. vs. Argentina (2010)
3. first vs. Barcelona (2013)
2. vs. Brazil (2014)
1. vs. Chelsea (2012)

I believe this list still can change.
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Old 15-09-2018, 10:16   #3628
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Champions' league round of 16 and round of 8 aren't big\ important games? If so what a rubbish player Messi, de Bruyne, Hazard etc are.
When was the last time Messi did anything relevant in the Champions League?
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Old 15-09-2018, 10:21   #3629
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Most important goals of Müller in my opinion:
5. first vs. England (2010)
4. vs. Argentina (2010)
3. first vs. Barcelona (2013)
2. vs. Brazil (2014)
1. vs. Chelsea (2012)

I believe this list still can change.
I would add his goal against Juventus in 2016.
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